The a330NEO design is to directly compete with the 787 and the 767 The a350 design is against the 777 and so their goal is to improve thrust and efficiency over the 777 with the new a350. Opinions expressed here are the author's alone, and have not been reviewed, approved or otherwise endorsed by any of these entities. For this analysis we will not discuss the 787-8 and A330-800neo since they represent a much smaller fraction of new orders and deliveries. Maybe they can’t decide on whether on 7-abreast or 8-abreast (that would be like re-inventing the A300/310 all over again). Airbus wanted to create a version of the A300 that had the most powerful engines possible, but found that customers were leaning towards a b… First revealed at the 2014 Farnborough Airshow, the Airbus aircraft has been gaining ground within the … Get the Polaris product working properly in you entire fleet and lounges before thinking on buying new planes! However for a given passenger load the Dreamliner can either fly further (for an extra 1.5-2 hours) or carry more cargo. LOL, well they DO have A350-900s on order – so I kinda wish they WOULD get the 330neo since I believe they’re type rated the same and also to keep future 787 prices in-check. I personally believe that they will go with a mix of 787-8/9 (fleet commonality) and 797 MOM (fits the mission profile where a 787 is overkill, eg Europe and South America). It’s the thorn in the 787’s side that prevents higher profits. On the maintenance front the Dreamliner’s carbon airframe should give it a cost advantage on paper but in practice facilities still need to become more familiar with those new procedures. Last October there were stories that a major airline — possibly United — was considering an order of 50-100 Boeing 767s. The Boeing aircraft therefore covers a wider market and also flies faster (Mach.85 vs.82 for … To prevent customers from moving towards Airbus’ A330neo, Boeing could discount 787′s price. - Sitio web de aeronáutica sobre aviones y compañas aéreas (vuelo, foto, viaje, flota, lista deproducción de Airbus Boeing Douglas Embraer Dash, Embraer, ATR, Canadair, Skhoi...), fotos de aviones, base de datos de vuelos, noticias de la aviación, foro … Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. What plane do you think United is most likely to add to their fleet? Passionate about Aviation and Formula 1. United wouldn’t touch the A330neo. Someone who works for VS posted on another thread a year or more ago that their relatively new 233K A333ceos costs less to operate when including capital costs than their 787-9s. The Boeing 787 Dreamliner, too has very narrow seats in a nine­abreast layout, which means you lose elbow room in the 3­-3­-3 configuration. He travels about 400,000 miles a year, primarily using miles and points to enhance his first class experiences. The 797 is sizewise more similar to the 767 but has a more limited range (around 5,000 nautical miles) than the 787, and would be well suited for flights from CONUS to western Europe. "There's a Jetstar A330 following us home to Melbourne today,'' 787 pilot Jeremy Schmidt announced from the cockpit before the 10-hour haul. ( Log Out /  With these normalized LOPAs (Layout Of Passenger Accommodations) we found the A330-300 to be within two seats of the 787-9 and more than 30 seats away from the 787-10 (no wonder an A330neo cannot compete with the 787-10; they are not in the same capacity class). The problem is that what United needs is a 76 replacement. But, it takes a good look at the airlines operating this aircraft to see that not everything is as […] Note: Please see my Advertiser Disclosure. Breeze Airways Wants To Pay Pilots How Much?! A330-800 has steep uphill slog. – EPSILON AVIATION, Why did Virgin Atlantic order the A330neo? Similar range + capacity, similar pressure + humidity in the cabin. The owner of this site is not an investment advisor, financial planner, nor legal or tax professional and articles here are of an opinion and general nature and should not be relied upon for individual circumstances. The 787-9 can fly 300 passengers on segments of 7000 nautical miles or more, which isn’t the case of the A330-900neo. Meanwhile, when flying back in the economy, the 2-4-2 configuration on 330 is definitely better than the 3-3-3 on 787. i don’t know what’s holding back Boeing from actually launching the 797-MoM. Thats why they designed both aircraft (a330NEO, a350). The lower A330-900neo capital costs compared to the 787-9 mean that if the airline mostly flies shorter segments (transatlantic flights for example) without much cargo and has lower utilization ratios, the Airbus aircraft has an all-in unit cost advantage. The 800neo versus the Boeing 787-8 and the 900neo versus the Boeing 787-9 will be dealt with in future articles. COVID-19 is claiming another victim, and it may be one that nobody saw coming – The A330neo. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Change ), Work in the Financial Industry as a Quantitative Analyst in New York. Required fields are marked *. @ZI Having said that Airbus will need to pick up more A330neo orders to bring fresh momentum to the program, the Dreamliner being well ahead on that front. The extra inch or so over the Dreamliner (mostly nine-across in coach) makes a difference on longer flights. It has a big advantage in seat width – with the exception of a very few low-cost carriers, it’s eight-across in coach, with 18-inch-wide seats. Apparently their rationale for selecting the 777 was that the 330’s ceilings were too low. Earn 60,000 bonus points | 2X points on travel and dining. On the other hand the 787-9 will be a better aircraft for longer flights (transpacific) and routes with more cargo demand. Isn’t the 787-8 in the same size/range as the 767-300/400 that United flies? However, despite this claim, and despite the introduction of the Airspace by Airbus cabin on the A330neo, there is a notable difference in the design of the cabin of the 787. Just as Boeing did with the 747-8i to the A380 – the A330neo doesn’t just exist to get orders. I highly doubt they want the cost and complexity of adding a whole new type to their fleet. The 76 is optimized for transatlantic flying and thought the 78 can be configured passenger count size the 78 is an airplane built for longer distances that what American Airlines and in turn United Airlines will use it for. A new version with modern engines developed for the Boeing 787 was called for by owners of the current A330. For what reasons it is true? Have you considered the possibility that they leaked rumors that they’re considering Airbus just to have some leverage with Boeing? The wider A330-900neo wings (that bring more lift at takeoff) mean that it isn’t necessarily the case the 787-9 has better field performances in spite of a lighter airframe. The Boeing 787 is a winning concept from an engineering point of view. Change ), You are commenting using your Facebook account. One Mile at a Time is owned by PointsPros, Inc. The airline has a further 14 on order, though they’re the 787-10 variant. The A330neo ("neo" for "New Engine Option") is a development from the initial A330 (now A330ceo — "Current Engine Option"). View all posts by epsilonaviation. I’ll be curious to see how this develops. 787 Up to 30 more seats than 787 Comparison at 4000nm, $2/USg, Typical 3-class configuration, JAR 3% flight profile, LRC, 200nm diversion Monthly Lease Rates difference: A330neo vs 787 0.2M New generation efficiency A330neo cost efficiency Operating cost +15% A330neo 787 Datum Direct Operating Cost … Register here to save your space. Accordingly the 787’s block time for this flight is taken as 10.4 hours whereas the A330neo will take 10.8 hours. A330neo enables profitability on shorter ranges where the longer-range A350 and Boeing 787 aren't optimized. United Airlines has about 50 Boeing 767s in their fleet, which are an average of 21 years old. A330 and A350 have almost the same size, weight and passenger capacity (the undeveloped A350-800 should be also more similar), and also engines are very similar, the same family … The Boeing aircraft therefore covers a wider market and also flies faster (Mach .85 vs .82 for the Airbus aircraft). The passenger version of the plane is no longer in production, but since they still produce the cargo version, it wouldn’t be too tough to restart production. The re-engined version of Airbus’s best selling aircraft has had its praises sung by airlines, passengers and planespotters alike. A330-900neo lease rates are commensurably lower than those of a 787-9. It would seem possible that talking to Airbus about the A330 is a negotiating tactic to get the best price out of Boeing for more 787s. Travel in the Time of COVID: The news, resources, & information you need. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. This comes from both a higher maximum takeoff weight and a carbon airframe, the latter giving a fuel burn advantage (and resulting trip cost advantage). As of January 31, 2020, Boeing delivered 1,629 777 aircraft including 88 777-200s, 422 777-200ERs, 60 777-300s, 819 777-300ERs, 60 777-200LRs, and 180 777Fs. It looks like another major US airline is nearing a plane order. Boeing 787 production rate increase to 14/mo next year is, in part, a head-‘em-off-at-the-pass maneuver to prevent customers from buying the Airbus A330neo. Much newer than the A330, which first started flying 16ish years ago. Just like with the A330neo, though, I will not talk about that one in this article. United already has a fleet of 37 787s, including 12 787-8s, and 25 787-9s. While Boeing is quick to point out the benefits of higher cabin pressure and humidity compared to a metal airframe, Economy seats are meaningfully tighter than on the A330neo in standard configuration (17.3 vs 18 inches). The 787-10 is basically the -3 with longer range and a common wing with the -8s/-9s. After listing the winner (if any) on a number of criterion in a summary table we will discuss each one of them: The 787-9 and A330-900neo have virtually the same passenger capacity and resulting ground turnaround time. The 787-10 is 5.5 meters longer than 787-9 and competes with the slightly shorter A350-900. It will depend on the specific airline configuration whether there can be more seats on the Airbus or Boeing aircraft. While I’m sure United could have scored a deal on these planes, that’s not exactly the most efficient plane out there nowadays in terms of operating costs per seat. So how I see it is the 333 is a better airplane for what United wants to use it for though the 78 will allow fleet continuity and some American spirit. The face-off between Airbus A330neo and Boeing 787 pits two generations of jetliner against each other in the long-haul segment, predicted to represent $1 trillion in sales over 20 years ( Log Out /  I thought the a350 was the direct competitor to the 787. Lucky, what do you think about the rumor Boeing developing a new MoM airplane to replace the aging 767/757’s. I wish Boeing could bring back the 787-3 concept as their 757/767 replacement. The Airbus A330neo ("neo" for "New Engine Option") is a wide-body jet airliner developed by Airbus from the Airbus A330 (now A330ceo – "Current Engine Option"). The airline has a further 14 on order, though they’re the 787-10 variant. These planes will eventually need replacing, though there’s not really a direct replacement for the aircraft, given that it’s a bit smaller than the 787 or A330. Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. It seems logical enough that United would simply choose to expand their 787 fleet, though I guess if Airbus can dangle them enough of a carrot, anything is possible. As a result Airbus can be more aggressive on the pricing front to win new orders. Enter your email address to follow this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. While we do try to list all the best miles and points deals, the site does not include all card companies or credit card offers available in the marketplace. Only Japan Airlines has a 2­-4-­2 layout —and, as a bonus, JAL also gives passengers extra legroom. This deal will potentially be worth $14 billion at list prices. They just want PR inorder to preassure Boeing to push the price down! Your email address will not be published. That’s just 8 narrow chairs for not-so-narrow Americans. Delta Air Lines took advantage of that when swapping A350 deliveries for the A330-900neo. After the first A330-900neo delivery to TAP Air Portugal I thought it relevant to compare the Airbus aircraft to its closest competitor, the Boeing 787-9. Reminder: OMAAT comments are changing soon. Airbus A330neo customer and A330 specialist CIT outlines the average A330 sector as being around 1800nm (2070mi/3330km), and says that a 787 attempting to compete with an A330 on such routes, is typically not an economically tenable solution, given the investment in “all that wing, all that … I’d bet the farm they go with the 787s not the A330s. https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/boeing-sees-big-opportunity-in-new-midsize-aircraf-446371/. Fly 300 passengers on segments of 7000 nautical miles or more, which ’. Between the two advantage compared to the 787 ’ s the size/range difference between the two | 2X points travel... Due to its relatively slow sales so far there are 2 other criterion that favor the Dreamliner either! 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